D&D 3.5 - Athas

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D&D 3.5 - Athas

Post by ^^Truth on 6th July 2009, 7:56 am

Village Name : Sekmhet

Sekmhet is a small, reclusive village built upon a red rock outcropping in the middle of the desert. The population is a reasonably steady number amounting around 20-24 people in small families.

Sekmhet sits about forty foot above the surrounding sands, with two arching red rock paths that lead to the larger plateau providing a good solid defence and shelter from the roaming sands and burrowing bugs that crawl before them.

The settlement is made up soley of Yurts.

Local Geography

North : Apart from the endless shifting sands of importance is the lair of Nek'hekaka (see below), whose offspring provides both food and materials for your tribe. The lair of Nek'hekaka is several miles north of the village, the path to the lair marked noticeably by X crossed sticks. The lair itself is a huge downwards sand sink with Nek'hekaka at the bottom and visible at all times.

East : The desert stretches for days to the east of the village, eventually fading into red rock barrens and finally to a never-ending haze of impressive greenery.

Whilst the sands in this direction have no noticeable difference from anywhere else, the rocky badlands however are noted for their abundance of large, even giant, insects and are regarded as off limits for the safety of the tribe members.

The ever-stretching jungle itself is visited at maximum once per five years and no more. Noted for carnivorous plant life, stalking powerful predators and flesh burrowing insects. It is most definitely hailed as offlimits and would take more water than is personally carryable to reach regardless.

West : Deserts stretched for limitless amounts to the west of the village, of note are the obsidian patches and the Temple of Youth (see below).

The obsidian patches are the villages only real tradeable item. Across the desert small obsidian stores are to be found buried beneath the sands in which the women of the tribe gather and fashion into jewelry.

The Temple of Youth is an ancient structure whose original purpose has long since be lost. The temple rests half buried and at an angle within the sands and is the first testing grounds in the Trials of Adulthood (see below).

South : Not too much is known about the south, other than it quite quickly turns to rocky badlands and is the favoured places for the hunters of the tribe to find fresh meats and skins. The land is noteable dangerous however, claiming many lives to the beasts that lay in wait for the careless hunter.

Traditions

Religion : Nek'hekaka is your tribes deity. Nek'hekaka has taken the form of a gigantic worm-like beast rumoured to be several miles long that represents the endless sands, fertility and protection.

Nek'hekata sleeps however, only waking every five years to celebrate the coming of adulthood amongst it's sacred children. When Nek'hekata awakes, an offering of meat, flowers, water and fruits is offered to it, which it devours before returning to sleep to overwatch the village and his scared children in it's slumber.

However, were the village to be truely threatened, Nek'hekaka will awake and devour the attackers, protecting his scared children.

Nek'hekaka also provides it's literal offspring to the village for the devotion of your people. The offspring, large worm-like creatures much like Nek'hekata can grow from between two and fifteen foot in length, along with several foot in diameter and provide a salty meat when slaughtered and tough, yet flexible skins which make up most of the clothing and building materials of the tribe. Their teeth also make excellent materials for tools and weaponry.

The Trial of Adulthood : The Trial of Adulthood takes places every five years for members of the tribe aged between 15 and 20. The trial itself contests of four phrases and if successfully completed, the surviving young tribemen are granted the rights of adulthood by Nek'hekaka.

The first stage of the trial sees the young tribesmen to undertake the journey split into half and face off against each other in a game of Dog Ball, the members of the winning team earning the right to wield the most scared possession of the tribe.

The second stage consists of the young tribes members journeying to the Temple of Youth to retrieve Nek'hekaka's Spite, the holy and most scared relic of the tribe. After the trial is completed, the spear is returned back to it's holy resting place awaiting the next group of young tribesmen.

The third stage takes the young tribesmen away from camp, across the dangerous badlands to the east and to the jungles, where they must gather flowers, fruits and finally use Nek'hekaka's Spite to slay a Remkank Tigra, a large and powerful six legged cat-like predator.

The fourth and last stage sees the young tribesmen journey back to the village then prepare to present their offering to the mighty Nek'hekaka. Once all is ready, if Nek'hekaka awakes and devours the offered goods, then all young tribesmen become adults of the tribe, if not however it is deemed that the young tribesmen have done something to offend Nek'hekaka and are exiled from the tribe to find their own way.

The Temple of Youth :

Dog Ball :

Day to Day Life

Notable Tribesmen


Last edited by ^^Truth on 19th July 2009, 6:15 am; edited 17 times in total

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Re: D&D 3.5 - Athas

Post by ^^Truth on 6th July 2009, 7:56 am

Explaination of Extra House Rules.

Armour - This rule would change armour from providing defence (AC) to reducing damage when stuck (damage reduction). It's supposed to work in combination with lower hit points, dexterous dodging and parrying to balance out the combat system. Below is a sample of normal PHB armours in this system.

Leather Armour - DR 1
Studded Armour - DR 2
Chainshirt - DR 3 (chest)
Chainmail - DR 3 (full)
Breastplate Armour - DR 4/3 (chest/other)
Splint/Banded Mail - DR 4
Platemail - DR 5
Full Plate - DR 6

Helms will be available for all armour types. Mix and matching different armour types works just fine, because of the hit location system. Thus it's possible to actually get better breastplate armour, for example, by purchasing a platemail or full plate breastplate and say chainmail for the rest of your body, which would give you armour 6/3 (chest/other), or putting on a full plate helm with leather armour would give you the normal DR 1 for armour, but hits to your head would have DR6.

I think that potentially DR6 is a bit too high, but we'll see how it goes.

Hide armours will work off the natural armour bonus of the creature the hide was created from, but virtually always lower, how much lower depends on the quality of the armoursmith creating the hide armour.

All other modifiers for armour will still exist. Unless there is a good reason to change them.

Dexterity and AC - Armour class is literally about *not* being hit, as soon as someone actually strikes your armour, you have been hit. Thus armour class will be decided by dodge factors alone.

Dexterity will be a literal representation of ones AC. Thus Dexterity 13 gives you AC 13, Dexterity 7 gives you AC 7 and so on.

Feats such as Dodge, or Combat Expertise will improve AC still as they did before and should now be more benefical to the nimble, lightly armoured warrior whom cannot afford to be struck all the time.

Armour check modifiers will apply as a negative onto armour class. Thus a DEX 12 tank in platemail (ArmourCheckPenalty -7) would actually end up with an armour class of 5.

Shields however still grant the AC bonus they did before and their Armour Check Penalty doesn't apply as a negative to your AC.

The system might seem harsh, but I do not think that will actually be the case. Typically people should have a harder time fighting low-level monsters than they usually would, but will have an easier time fighting higher level monsters. This is because the low-level have a low BAB so are likely to actually hit more, where as high level monsters generally struck regardless of your armour class, thus at least with the two systems above a heavily armoured warrior will still keep a large benefit of wearing armour.

The dodge system will remain under review however, as I haven't thought through a lot of potentially character builds and may either be too powerful (for what I am aiming for) or far too harsh.

If ACs should turn out too low however, simplying granting PCs +1 Exprience AC per 5 levels may well help fix the issue and makes better sense to me anyway.

Parrying - Due to AC being potentially nerfed to pieces for certain builds and/or armour not being able to 100% protect you all the time, a simple parry rule will be included into the game, which should hopefully spice things up a bit.

Your Parry Rating (PR) is equal to your BAB. As BAB grants your multiple attacks, you earn an additional number of parries also.

All shields grant one additional free parry equal to your maximum BAB. Thus a warrior with a BAB of +17/+12/+7/+2 and a shield, would have parries equal to +17/+17/+12/+7/+2.

Some items, equip and combinations will grant parrying bonuses.

Small Shields - +2 parry
Large Shields - +4 parry
Two-Handing Fighting with a TINY weapons in the offhand grants a +2 parry bonus.

I've just noticed that they changed a lot of tiny/small weapons to light weapons in the SRD. Tiny are basically dagger size items. Ask if you're confused. Shortswords don't count though.

A successful parry, renders an attack useless.

Weapon Changes - Some weaponry will be changed, hopefully for the better. Not too much mind you, but may well be updated as things come up. Happy to listen to suggestions also.

-------------------------------

Light Crossbows : 1d10 damage.
Heavy Crossbow : 2d6 damage.

Javelins : 1d10 damage (when thrown, otherwise normal).
Throwing Axes : 1d8 (When thrown, otherwise normal).

Greatsword : 1d12 damage.
Greataxe : 2d6 damage.

Battleaxe : 1d10 damage (in two hands).
Warhammer : 1d10 damage (in two hands).


-------------------------------

Ranged combat and melee combat often do not stack up as well, due to the bonus from melee combat (damage wise) being much higher than ranged, usually making ranged very lacking, especially as combat in D&D generally starts at a very short range.

To combat this, DEXTERITY will provide a damage bonus to ranged weaponry, just as STRENGTH does for melee weapons. An explaination of this is better hand-eye coordination helps land the dagger, arrow, javelin in a better position for increased damage.

Weapons that can potentially use STR as a damage bonus, can use one or the other, not both. People with High-STR Bows, throwing axes and so on will have to decide whether they wish to use STR or DEX to deal damage with.

Feats - Some new feats will be added into the game, a lot of other feats will be having a pretty simple overhaul.

Firstly. All attribute requirements for feats are removed. Thus it's not necessary to min/max your light armoured warrior PC because you need combat expertise for your build idea. This change should provide no problem at all.

Secondly, the following feats now exist.

Expert Parrier* : Minimum BAB+1. Proficiency with chosen weapon or shield.
Benefit : Grants a +2 parrying bonus when using the chosen weapon or shield type. Only applies to one weapon or shield per purchase. Maybe purchased multiple times.

Man-at-Arms*: Minimum Level 8. Proficiency in armour chosen.
Benefit : Provides an additional +1 point of DR with the chosen armour type. Only applies to one armour type per purchase. Maybe purchased multiple times but for different armours.

Second-Skin* : Minimum BAB+1. Proficiency in armour chosen.
Benefit : Reduces the armour check penalty to AC (not skills) with the selected armour by 2 points. Maybe purchased multiple times for either the same or different armours.

*Counts as fighter bonus feat selection.

Arcane Magics - A lot of armour spells are fine, some need changing because of the new systems, some are totally not fine considering lower amounts of HPs.

Firstly, mages will no longer (again) recieve free spells every time they level up. They can however spend time to research and learn spells, as long as they have enough coinage and time to do so.

Most important, the following spells are changed for various reasons.

Mage Armour : Provides DR 2/magic now. Duration is one minute/level.
Shield : Grants +4 AC from frontal attacks for it's duration.
Magic Missile : Now deals 1d3 damage per missile and bypasses non-magical armours.

There will be MANY more spells that likely requiring changing slightly to fit the new system, however I cannot do all of them for, what should be obvious, reasons right now and we'll come to them when we come to them.

Divine Magics - With lower HPs, the amount of healing needs to be changed slightly. I always thought there was far too much, and too powerful, healing in D&D anyway.

Cure Minor Wounds : Heals 1 HP. (normal PHB rules).
Cure Light Wounds : Heals 1 HP per level, upto 5 HP.
Cure Moderate Wounds : Heals 1 HP per level, upto 10 HP.
Cure Serious Wounds : Heals 1 HP per level, upto 15 HP.
Cure Critical Wounds : Heals 1 HP per level, upto 20 HP.

The AoE versions of the above spells (Mass Cure Light Wounds etc) heal identical amounts to the spells listed above.

As already stated as well. Clerics now have to learn their spells from prayer scrolls. Just like a wizard learns his spells, but they use Knowledge Religion for the role instead. Also, as stated with Arcane Magics, there may well be many more magics that require changing, but we'll come to them when we do.


Last edited by ^^Truth on 13th July 2009, 11:54 pm; edited 15 times in total

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Re: D&D 3.5 - Athas

Post by ^^Truth on 6th July 2009, 7:57 am

Okay. This is going to be longer than the last one I wrote. I'll try to keep to point form when possible so it's easier to read.

To add here. I would actually prefer if people didn't bother reading up as much information about Dark Sun as possible. Even the Wikia entry has SERIOUS epic adventure spoilers in it. Basically no information will be required as the players have lead very isolated lives and what they do know will be explained either before, or in game.

Campaign : Tribal.

All the PCs are tribe members in a typical post-apocalyptic sense. One of the PCs maybe from outside the tribe, but has been living within it for four or five years (to be explained). The tribe is small, 20-25 people in total, including the PCs and live a solitary existence in the desert wastes.

Crazy haircuts like head half-shaved, mohawks, angel wings and so on are totally legit, along with odd bone/obsidian piercings and tattoos, or anything else the PCs wish.

Races Allowed : Elf*, Human, Mul*. Halfling is also fine if people are desperate to play one.

*There can be two elves or Mul's, but the PCs will have to be siblings.

Elf can be subsituted for Half-Elf.

Classes Allowed : Barbarian, Bard, Fighter, Ranger, Thief only.

Bards* will recieve no magical abilities. Their "music inspiration" abilities will come from war screams, battle cries and rallying calls (or any other mundane means the PC wishes to choose). Their abilities of Fascination, Suggestion and Mass Suggestion will be replaced with abilities that increase the defense of their companions and perhaps imbue temporary HP benefits.

To counter the loss of magic, bards will receive Fighter BAB and a bonus feat at 5th, 10th, 15th and 20th.

Rangers* will recieve no magical abilities nor an animal companion. Instead they will recieve a 1d6 sneak attack at 5th level, that increases at 10th, 15th and 20th. This sneak attack ability will only function with ranged weaponry, but the distance is increased to 60' (over the usual 30').

*Adjusted classes may not be final implementation.

Attribute System : 80 point buy + 1d6 randomiser*

*Okay, was decided to use this way by the majority and it works out well enough. Stats are going to be the usual point buy with 80 points, assign where ever you wish 1 for 1. After that is done, each stat will then have a 1d6 dice roll applied to it, which will adjust the stat permanently in the following fashion.

1 : -3
2 : -2
3 : -1
4 : +1
5 : +2
6 : +3

Statistics have to be rolled now, because of the way the attributes work for non-humans (more bonuses than minuses). If you would all like more powerful PCs (not a bad thing), then 4d4+4 is acceptable, or perhaps 3d6+2.

Also, if people wish to keep the party power level equal, I will entertain the idea of only 6 rolls being made and everyone using those stats. putting them where they wish and adjusting them by any modifiers. Humans I think I would have to allow a little adjustment statwise so they ended up with dithering stats.

Alignment : Good/Neutral. Preferrable with more good than neutral.

"Good" in Dark Sun is still good by all accounts, but the world is harsh and unforgiving, thus "good" PCs have much more leway than in other typical worlds.

Starting Equipment : Will be handed out on a case by case basis.

Racial Adjustments : As Below.

Elves : Recieve +4 dexterity, +2 intelligence, -1 wisdom, -2 constitution.
Muls : Recieve +3 strength, +3 constitution, -2 charisma, -1 intelligence.
Humans : Recieve +2 skill points a level and two additional feats at 1st level.*

*I may also grant humans a +10% XP benefit.

The racial benefits for Elves are different to PHB, any benefits will be described to players picking the races by email. Some examples of how the other races differ to human would be, Elves base movement is 50' a round and Mul's can forcemarch for 3 days in a row (20 hours a day), on the 4th day however a Mul must "rest". "rest" for a Mul means only walking for 10 hours!.

I am sure people would like to know a lot about the individual races and how they differ from the norm before picking, but it's a lot for me to write up and explain if they're not going to be picked. I will do my best to answer any individual questions however.

I will write up the stats for halflings if someone actually expresses an interest in playing one. Like all other races, they do not match the norm for D&D races.

Roles - Explained below.

There are particular roles within the village. To be filled.

Outsider - Works best as an Elf, but could alternatively be a human. Was rescued from the desert by the village elder and nursed back to health, almost becoming an adoptive son. The village elder has no children. Neutral bent PC.

Child of the Hunter - Mother died soon after childbirth. Works best as a Mul (their mothers typically die after childbirth). Good bent PC. Father is now next in line to become Village Elder.

Child of Heroes - Has a younger sister. Both parents died in battle while protecting the village from raiders when the PC was young, left caring for sister. Works best as a male, but female fine. Lawful bent PC (good also nice). Father would have been next in line to become Village Elder, making a male PC fourth in line, after the Hunter's father.

Child of Trader - Father spends most of his time away from the village. The only person to leave the village to see others in generations. Nearest trade settlement is perhaps 5-8 days away, thus missing for periods of 10-16 days every month. Chaos bent PC.

Plenty of other possibilities, but if some of those roles could be fulfilled I would be pretty happy. I have much more information to give to people that decide to choose any of the above, along with background material and so on. Role of the family will help in picking starting equipment and should likely be a guideline towards charcter class and possibly alignment.

The "alignment bent" bits of the descriptions are just pure guildlines and can be completely ignored.

An Elf is tough to add in without him being the outsider. Elves are nomadic, slightly xenophobic and very distrusting. But possible. Yet if someone wishes to play an elf and someone else wishes to be the outsider, it's best the players resolve the conflict.

Information - As Below

To be done. This section will give a basic idea of the campaign, the settlement, surrounding territory and day to day life, including festivals, rituals and an idea of how the campaign will be starting. Also a possible run down of the NPCs in the village.

This section will be updated when I remember all the things I have to explain, I'll get some important ones out of the way right now however.

1. All classes have been selected for their non-magical natural (or adjusted to). However! There will be opportunities along the path of the campaign for PCs to ventrue into other paths of expertise (classes), including arcane*, psicionic and clerical, but these things must be learnt from NPCs that are willing to teach and explain.

*Arcane magic is being handled extremely different to the norm. It will be explained should anyone manage to convince someone to teach them such powerful and rare arts.

2. All PCs are young, aged between 15-20. This includes any possible Elves (Elves only live to 120 in Dark Sun).

3. A ranger, or thief/bard on the lines of a ranger, is a very, very good idea indeed.

4. Skills of survival, weaponsmithing, armoursmithing and heal will be extremely useful. Survival for (I hope) obvious reasons. Weapon/Armour creation because virtually all equipment in Dark Sun is made from non-metals and heal purely because the desert is a dangerous place.

5. Weaponry made from materials other than iron/steel (extremely rare and expensive) have negative values on their use. As below. I believe the idea of this system was to mix the high stats and negatives to provide some form of normal modifier and have weapons such as obsidian or steel almost having "magical" properties.

Iron/Steel : Normal
Obsidian : -1 hit/damage.
Bone : -2 hit/damage.
Stone : -3 hit/damage.
Wood -4 hit/damage.

Certain "material" choices combined with weaponry may make no sense to give a minus to. Such as stone or wooden clubs/staffs, or Obsdidian flinted arrows. However the negatives will remain because they do not function as well as their metallitic counter-parts.

However I may well adjust certain items to more-suit their intended purpose, for example making stone clubs have no negative to damage, but a larger negative to hit. If no one actually cares however/can just accept the way it's written currently, then we'll stick with it as it is for simplicity sake.

6. Psionics. Every being in Dark Sun is potentially psicionically latent. There will be a secret roll made by myself to see who may possess such powerful abilities. Like Arcane magic, it is unlikely I will be using the actual psicionics handbook and will instead work off what I wish to achieve and my image of 2E psicionics. No one will start at least knowing if they do, or do not have any such abilities anyway, but things may develope as the campaign moves onwards.

7. Armour. Dark Sun is/was the first D&D system to actually have tables for piecemail style armours. This works perfectly with my hit location/damage reduction system. I would prefer for people to have their different armour pieces protect where it is worn and that is all. However if anyone in particuarly has a serious issue with note-keeping or the possible complexity of having different armoured parts of their body, then I will work with them to just give them an overal value (even if it makes no sense).

Note

If there is anything I've missed or question arise, please ask them in this thread and I'll reply asap.


Last edited by ^^Truth on 18th July 2009, 7:24 am; edited 20 times in total

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Re: D&D 3.5 - Athas

Post by illumination on 6th July 2009, 8:18 pm

i think its a nice idea, doesnt clash with CoC at all either so worth a crack. we havent had much success running two games at once before but i hope we can make it work out. its certainly worth the risk in any case, and CoC was meant to be a shortish thing.

so, to that end i will stick down some preferences:

1, 2, 3, all good. 5 is very interesting but more challenging DM wise. im pretty chilled about that list really, anything is workable.

i prefer system #1 on Hp's, however it can get broken if there are any mages or clerics even, although with the spells being what you get given maybe not too bad. easiest would be if there arent any. i could live with making a PC with what remains and low magic parties have interesting challenges and have to think outside the box more.

i would say CON is good enough as it is and would shy away from any changes that make it even more significant. #2 for example.

id also like to say that before we begin that we need to look into power attack with 2handed weapons and str bonuses. its savage ATM and well imba, init.

the house rules list is okay, i prefer some bits to others, parry for eg may work nicely if kept simple. (id base it off bab vs bab as a measure of raw skill between combatants)

the dex stuff is more complicated, i think if there are too many big changes as well as the HP's in a one-er it could go tits.

as to PC's, i reckon id be looking at a CN elf rural thief.

with a barrat .50









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Re: D&D 3.5 - Athas

Post by ^^Truth on 7th July 2009, 1:49 am

Post 2 updated.

Also. Was already going to do the same thing with parrying. I agree with the damage two-handed weapons deal, but not completely sure about how to deal with it.

Most of that bonus damage comes from the new rules for power attack, the problem is, those rule make sense when trying to make one-handers and two-handers deal different levels of damage. If you revert the changes, you have problems that one-handers work out better than two-handers.

Current Rules
Farmer A : STR 10 : Longsword. Power Attack +5. 1d8+5 damage on hit. -5 to hit. 6-13 damage
Farmer B : STR 10 : Zweihander. Power Attack +5. 2d6+10 damage on hit. -5 to hit. 12-22 damage.


Old Rules
Farmer A : STR 10 : Longsword. Power Attack +5. 1d8+5 damage on hit. -5 to hit. 6-13 damage
Farmer B : STR 10 : Zweihander. Power Attack +5. 2d6+5 damage on hit. -5 to hit. 7-17 damage.


But Farmer A gets to use ANOTHER weapon OR a shield as well. Thus the old rules didn't really work. Especially if Farmer A is stacking up two weapon fighting power attacks.

If anyone has any suggestions however, I'm game to listen.

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Re: D&D 3.5 - Athas

Post by #1! on 7th July 2009, 3:07 am

Teehee, I knew you luvved D&D and wanted to marry it. HEEHOO!

But, yeah, like Mike, I prefer option #1 for HP and options 1-3 for setting, although 5 & 6 could be interesting they would probably end up being more difficult to make fun.

I like the parrying, armour as DR, changes to spells, etc etc but you know that already. Not terribly keen on a good party. Prefer to have a more neutral PC.

Other than that, got nothing else to really add (the above most likely didn't help at all).

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Re: D&D 3.5 - Athas

Post by ^^Truth on 7th July 2009, 3:13 am

Well.

I am actually thinking of using Option 5 for the start, it wouldn't be major, major mind you.

To add.

I really wanted to do a good campaign to be honest.

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Re: D&D 3.5 - Athas

Post by Tromador on 7th July 2009, 3:47 am

I'm really enjoying the CoC (well done Mike!) and I know I can't manage to find time for two games just now. Also, if I'm 100% honest, more D&D doesn't really float my boat at the moment, not unless it was somewhat off the wall in very different campaign environment.

So... I will bow out of this one, rather than end up trying (unsuccessfully) to juggle time and holding everyone up.

One thing I will say is that having been on the receiving end of "no free spells" it's a complete bitch if not managed properly. Parties tend to rush around, which makes being a mage hard enough, without having to find time to research spells. Added to that, a parade of adventures without so much as a spell scroll dropping simply means you end up with an underpowered mage. This is unbalancing in the party and frustrating for the player.

Being as Clerics/Bards will now have 'spellbooks' too, obviously this applies to them too.

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Re: D&D 3.5 - Athas

Post by ^^Truth on 7th July 2009, 4:11 am

Okay.

I mean, I wouldn't assume Mike is going to run CoC every week. I forsee a more, CoC one week and D&D the next, rotation system that offers the DMs a break.

Anyway.

What do you consider an "off-the-wall" style of campaign?

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Re: D&D 3.5 - Athas

Post by #1! on 7th July 2009, 1:05 pm

So Iain and I tested out his new combat system and it was pretty successful, if I'm any judge. Sure, there are some flaws, but it's all very easy to negotiate and it's pretty rooted in common sense, so realism applies. I think I described it best when asked for my opionion: "it's like CoC and D&D had a baby."

I kinda figured we'd be doing some sort of alternation between this and Mike's CoC. I think that would work quite well, mostly because it would let Iain and Mike have chances DMing AND playing, which I'm very much in favour of. Plus it gives Mike extra time to make CoC even creepier!

If by "off-the-wall" Trom means Planescape or Dark Sun or something, I'd be in favour of something like that. Especially PS. But bog-standard crap is coo, too.

Oh, and Mike, if this gets off the ground, you wanna do a brother/sister thing like we did in Joe's Ravenloft? I quite liked those two and would be pleased to have another stab playing around with them.

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Re: D&D 3.5 - Athas

Post by Tromador on 7th July 2009, 9:39 pm

Off the wall, aye.. PS or DS or something.

Anything NOT the usual stuff I would consider - but not the standard issue high fantasy swords & sorcery we've been hacking away at for years.

And timing is still an issue I would need to consider.

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Re: D&D 3.5 - Athas

Post by ^^Truth on 8th July 2009, 5:18 am

Yes, the combat testing did go very well indeed. The combat system is indeed fearsome, much like Ogres.

Zerty, remind me, I was quite drunk, what were the flaws? Cos I don't remember Very Happy

Thinking about it, I'm quite happy to run Dambrath as well, that would work quite well I think.

Dark Sun is good, I like the idea of it, it's never worked in the past, but I am a far superior DM now than I was then. I do however have doubts about Mike's willingness to DM it as frequently as he may FR or PS.

Now Planescape is all well and good and I'm not objecting to it, but do you both realise what you're actually saying by "PS is fine/good"?

I mean, Planescape can be ANYTHING. Saying Planescape alone is not the basis of an idea at all, I think all it does mean is the PCs can have funky races and possible ECL.

I mean, I could run a PS campaign where you're all forced into the Baatorian Army to fight in the bloodwar, is that okay? or where you're all pawns in the GithWars™, that? Maybe you're servants of the egyptian Gods doing their bidding throughout the planes.. or maybe you're all viking that ride on flying pink ponies and believe love solves all problems.

Saying Planescape is fine, but ideas need to be added. Because it's very possible that I envisage a PS campaign that no one that wants to play PS actually likes. Very easy to do.

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Re: D&D 3.5 - Athas

Post by #1! on 8th July 2009, 6:29 am

A lot of the flaws were YOU CHEATING! Very Happy But, uh, mostly it was the parry rules and we fixed those up pretty well. It requires more testing, of course.

The fuck is Dambrath?

I gotta say, all those suggested "campaigns" sound fun. Honestly, I'm not too picky in the least about what sort of PS campaign is chosen, as long as it isn't something completely unworkable or faaaaaar too silly. Off the top of my head, some kind of criminal/thief-y PS-flavoured campaign would be fun, like Ocean's 11, but with Baatorian banks and mind flayer crime lord and all that jazz. Or something completely free-form. Or MAGICAL RAINBOW PONY SQUAD!

But you right, need more suggestion than just "hey, PS, plzkthnx."

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Re: D&D 3.5 - Athas

Post by Tromador on 9th July 2009, 11:37 pm

Yes, absolutely, PS requires more definition.

Point is I'm very flexible in scenarios. That Al-Qadim you were on about sounds pretty cool, jungles of Chult might be interesting... just not any of the 'usual' stuff.

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Re: D&D 3.5 - Athas

Post by #1! on 10th July 2009, 2:16 am

I think the main point of Iain saying PS requires more definition was for people to suggest campaign ideas themselves instead of just him doing it.

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Re: D&D 3.5 - Athas

Post by ^^Truth on 10th July 2009, 6:32 am

Alright. It's gonna be Dambrath for a start.

I mean, thing is, we're only deciding the start location, not the content, or basis, of the campaign.

We'll start somewhere in Dambrath.

I'll post up some Chargen details in a bit, it'll be under post 3.

#3 should also explain whatever needs to be known.


Last edited by ^^Truth on 13th July 2009, 6:32 am; edited 2 times in total

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Re: D&D 3.5 - Athas

Post by illumination on 11th July 2009, 1:48 am

Dambrath works for me, lot of rules changes mostly tho we won't know how they will balance up until we play.

Although at a glance the main thing I'd say that leaps out at me is that shields look too wicked and that with multiple parries Inc a free shield one at a plus may result in stalemates for high level fights and a 0% chance of a hit for anyone taking on anything more than few levels higher than them.

What HP system is in?

I'm still on for a CN rogue elf.

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Re: D&D 3.5 - Athas

Post by ^^Truth on 11th July 2009, 4:34 am

As Zert said, myself and him tested the system out and it worked very well. It'd be nice to see it outside of "lab conditions" mind you, because I'm sure other things will jump up.

We're just going to have to change things on the fly when required and keep an open mind about it all.

Shields might be good, I don't know. We'll see when we're playing, they feel right too me. Felt right in testing.

HP system is #1. It's updated in post #3 for clarification. I wrote #3 up while drunk and Zert was no help at all.

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Re: D&D 3.5 - Athas

Post by #1! on 11th July 2009, 4:48 am

I'm not the one on trial here!

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Re: D&D 3.5 - Athas

Post by ^^Truth on 11th July 2009, 10:09 am

Okay.

Having had a think and so on, I'm going to ask something that rarely gets asked, usually only half-asked. Mostly because people don't understand the importance of the question, don't care or have other things in mind. I would appreciate it, and it will be to everyones and my benefit, if you all answered this when possible.

What sort of campaign would everyone like to play in?

A fairly straight forward question, yes, but one that rarely gets asked, or answered, truthly and with merit.

I for example have an idea for a campaign. It might not be long, I don't know, I would envisage it ending by perhaps 10th level or so, one that is truely for good PCs, especially ones with honour and perhaps loyalty, or perhaps just human decency.

I can run throw-together sessions, like you all get most of the time, but sometimes I wonder if D&D, or RPGs in general, should be played as long as we *try* to play them.

DMs are there to entertain, much like musicians or actors, yet without pay, it's a fairly selfless act but without player participation pointless in the end. Thus I think it's important to really link with what you'd all like to do.

Zert expressed interest in playing but with a non-good PC, Mike I am unsure, Trom I don't even know if you're playing.

There are various things I could run, by my own personal preference, or yours. Unlike most DMs, I allow player choice when deciding upon games, something I do feel at times makes things even more complicated for myself with demands, as it were.

Usually I see what PCs I have and try to cater for them, try to work out some kind of storyline that interconnects, which is very hard and I seriously think most people couldn't handle so well, along with the frequency we play at.

Thus I am thinking of running what I think would be a good game and forcing you all to cater to it, but I do not necessarily wish to do that and would prefer to have full commitment behind the game.

So I ask.

There are so many things possible with the chosen start location, I will name some to give general ideas so you can all get your brain ticking when you think about replying.

I suppose in the end, I want honesty and thought put into the answers, so I would actually know what type of game people would like to play, at least for this one. Which will, in the end, help me craft something. I happen to be very capable at making sugar from shit, as it were.

So.

1. Thievery. (Like Conan the Barbarian.)
2. Racial War.
3. Class War.
4. Caste War.
5. Heroric.
6. Martyrdom.
7. Open-ended Adventure.

What words really spring to mind and give you visions of the game ahead, the possibilities.

I guess, I feel guilty in the past of dishing out fastfood D&D and would like to serve up now, providing I have the time and player participation to do so.

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Re: D&D 3.5 - Athas

Post by #1! on 11th July 2009, 11:40 am

As long as the campaign concept isn't completely insane (which I highly doubt from you), I'm willing to roll with most anything, as long as I can play the kind of character that I want.

I think out of those options you have, I'd be most partial toward #1. Old school Conan-like thievery, or just planning heists and shit. That sounds fun, but not exactly easy to do as a DM.

I'm not entirely sure what you mean by racial war. You mean, like uh, we'd be playing good-aligned Nazis? Or, more seriously, do you mean there being a main racial antagonist (drow, lizardmen, whatev) that the party faces off against in the grand scheme of things?

Heroic could be cool, being big damn heroes and stuff. But still, I likes me some grim n' gritty stuff. If those can be combined, that'd be pretty sweet in my opinion.

Open-ended is most likely the easiest and most flexible. I don't mind that.

I'll post some more about personal preferences in a bit once I've had some time to mull them over.

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Re: D&D 3.5 - Athas

Post by ^^Truth on 11th July 2009, 11:45 am

Open-ended isn't actually the easiest. I mean, it is for a while, until things become complicated or PCs get to high levels with no real goal in their lives other than personal ones that don't connect with each other.

Racial war would be like yes, a main antagonist, as it were, perhaps a changing one with my idea.

Heroic can be gritty too, infact it almost HAS to be gritty at times, or you woudln't be heroes. Survive thick and thin, right?

Happy to hear more.

Your acknowledgment of #1 is noted, feel free to suggest alternative ideas if you wish.

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Re: D&D 3.5 - Athas

Post by #1! on 11th July 2009, 11:46 am

Hmm, in that case...heroic sounds like lots of fun and lots of potential for badass moments and shit. I change my vote to that. After all, if I'm gunna play a Good character, I wanna be a fucking big damn hero =)

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Re: D&D 3.5 - Athas

Post by ^^Truth on 11th July 2009, 11:59 am

Works for me. Like to hear what everyone else has to say.

Thanks for the input Zertistan and if you have any alternative ideas lemme know (just not too many, eh? Very Happy).

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Re: D&D 3.5 - Athas

Post by illumination on 11th July 2009, 11:33 pm

7, with steady threads of 1, 2 and 6 thrown in i guess.

i actually think dark sun should be attempted now i look at this, because it is mega gritty, and with neutral PC's we can still be the good guys. as a setting, it also looks to me to be the most compatible with that specific list which provides clues as to what types of campaigns you would prefer to run.

but most most importantly, its DIFFERENT.

dambrath is a nice spot in fareun, and would be a change but im not sure if its enough of a change.

dark sun has its own problems, ie how to make it not totally morale breaking and depressing, but indeed we are much better DMs and players than the last time it was attempted.

(see successful CoC event for an example of something which didnt really get off the ground before but works now)

to come back to the original question, my concern with the storyline is less than the interaction with the other characters and the general setting we are in.

but elf's are well wierd in athas so i might have to rethink that one if we changed...

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Re: D&D 3.5 - Athas

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